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"Another embarrassing loss for Klish" • The National Council for Planning and Construction ordered to examine an alternative for a railway tunnel in Haifa

The National Council for Planning and Construction accepted the appeals of Dvir Langer, Shmuel Galbhart and Adam Teva and Din. This week the council ordered to examine an alternative of a railway tunnel in Haifa after the appeals sub-committee, headed by attorney Yitzhak Burt, canceled a previous decision on a sedimentation route along the coastline, which was promoted by Klish.


The decision was canceled after the appeals, which include three alternatives that allow the removal of the coastal railways and the connection of Haifa to its beaches and sea front, which were submitted by Yael Dori, head of planning at Adam Teva and Din, attorney Dvir Langer, representative of the heads of the authorities in the north, and Shmuel Gelbart, chairman of the Haifa Green Movement The former were accepted.

The appeals sub-committee - the National Planning and Construction Council, which accepted the appeals unanimously, stated in the decision:
"There were two errors in the decision of the Board of Governors: The Board of Governors erred by approving the plan before the examination ordered by the Board of Governors was completed regarding the acoustic shielding that would be erected, and erred by not referring to the alternative that was presented to it for the track route and the location of the Carmel Beach station and the claim that it was a proper alternative that harmed the environment The beach is smaller, which was not examined by the planning institution authorized to discuss the plan.
In view of these errors, we have decided to cancel the decision of the Foreign Ministry that is the subject of the appeal."

The railway in Hecht Park will be electrified with overhead electrification (Photo: Yaron Karmi)
The railway in Hecht Park - the fear is that this route will be electrified with overhead electrification (Photo: Yaron Karmi)

"Promote railway tunnels in Haifa"

Yael Dori, head of the planning department at Adam Teva and Dean, told Lahi Fe:
"Our position is that the deposit should be canceled and we have even sent a letter in this spirit. Our intention is to promote tunnels for the train - a fast tunnel from the station near Matam (instead of the Carmel beach) to the Government Kiryat and a tunnel for the train that currently blocks the beach - all this in order to link the city to the sea , to get a better train service for the residents of Haifa and the surrounding area.

One of the main aspects is to take the Carmel Beach station out of the beach to the other side of the main road (of course with a connection to the Carmel Beach switchboard) and thus open up an entire beach for residents to use.


"We prevented a terrible buffer between the city and the sea"

Adv. Dvir Langer (personal album)
Adv. Dvir Langer (personal album)

Attorney Dvir Langer (representing heads of authorities in the north of the country and dozens of residents of Haifa) said: "We welcome the decision canceling the plan of the municipality of Haifa and the Israel Railways to add approximately 750,000 cubic meters of concrete in the coastal environment near the Carmel Beach station, while erecting a kilometer-long wall several meters high, which would have created a terrible buffer between the city and the sea.

We welcome the National Council's support for "Alternative 11", according to which the new tracks in the western part of the city will be fully routed, using an underground station at the Matam Stadium and another underground station in Kiryat Shvarmet (with an underground interface to Carmelit).

We presented this alternative to the Haifa municipality back in 2017, and we have nothing but regret that the municipality preferred to promote alternative 102, according to which, as mentioned, huge engineering structures will be erected in the vicinity of the existing Hoof HaCarmel station (including the expansion of the bridges of Route 2 and the Meir Zore Bridge). 

Alternative 11 - which the appeals subcommittee referred to, compared to alternative 102 (red)

Accessibility to the center of the country by high-speed train

Attorney Dvir Langer:
As part of all the planning procedures, as well as in response to our petition to the High Court, the municipality reiterated that it is interested in adding tracks and walls along the seashore in Haifa according to the outline proposed by Israel Railways. According to the final plan proposed by us, the city of Haifa will have 6 train stations (stadium-mat "M, Kiryat Shmuel, Hafaretz Center, Chutzat Hafaretz, Kiryat Haim and Kiryat Shmuel/Motzkin). Alternative 11 will be promoted in the western part of the city (the Menohar axis between the stadium and Kiryat Shvaram). In addition, alternative 9 (Shidra Tunnel) will be promoted in the eastern part of the city. In this way, there will be accessibility to the center of the country, by high-speed train, in about 27 minutes' drive, both from the Matam junction and from the center of the Gulf.

We believe that there is no national infrastructure plan more important than the one in front of us - the addition of high-speed railways to Haifa and the north, and we have nothing but regret that the municipality has only opposed our plan over the years, without offering a quality alternative and while creating a situation whereby the existing railways along Haifa's shores will remain in the coastal environment for many years to come ( plus electricity poles), and may not be evacuated at all.

The plan to add high-speed rail to Haifa and the north, according to the route alternative we presented, will bring prosperity to Haifa and the entire north, and is the only way in our opinion to realize the vision of a green bay, prevent negative immigration, and create tens of thousands of quality jobs in Haifa and the entire north. 


"Another embarrassing loss for the mayor Dr. Einat Kalish Rotem"

Shmulik Galbhart (personal album)
Shmulik Galbhart (personal album)

Shmuel Galbhart, chairman of the Greens movement in Haifa, said:
This is an important achievement for Haifa and another embarrassing loss for the mayor Dr. Einat Kalish Rotem, who ran for election on the "sinking of the railway". After that she moved to support the coastal railway plan that cuts off Haifa from its beaches and its tourist sea front and boasted of a "victory": I was assured that the overhead electrification Temporary, until the rails are sunk.

It is important for me to emphasize that my alternative "alternative 10" shortens the travel time between the north and the center of the country. It does not skip Haifa, on the contrary. It will serve not only the city center, but also the residents of Hadar and Carmel, through the Carmelite.

3 alternatives were included in the petitions, which enable the removal of the coastal railways and the connection of Haifa to its beaches and sea front: Alternative 9 in a tunnel from the central Lev Hamfaretz straight to the Megad area after Atlit, without any more stations in Haifa in order to shorten the travel time between the north and the center of the country. My 10th alternative, in a tunnel from the Carmel beach station to Kiryat Shvarat, also shortens the travel time between the north and the center of the country. This is the fastest and cheapest solution to implement. Dvir's alternative 11, just like my alternative 10, but he proposes to bring South Haifa station closer to the stadium.

We are both opposed to alternative 102 of the railway management, and Klish makes a grave mistake that she supports it. Explanation: The train is only interested in one thing - electrification, as quickly and cheaply as possible, and they don't care about Haifa's beaches. Therefore, it is best for them - to carry out overhead electrification on the existing coastal railways, and to leave the disconnection between Haifa and its beaches and seafront.

Moti Blitzblau (Photo: Yaron Karmi)
Moti Blitzblau (Photo: Yaron Karmi)

Motti Blitzblau, city council member from the Greens:

This is an important appeal which, to our joy as Haifaites, was indeed successful, even if at first it seemed hopeless. It is still not clear what will happen at the end of the road, but the National Council obliges the Ministry of Transportation and the Planning Administration to present important and relevant alternatives that until now they have strangely and senselessly refused to discuss and instead have locked onto an illusory alternative that will only worsen the situation and will not achieve the goals for which it was created in the first place. We regret that there was no representation of the city's businessmen in the committee for the protection of the marine environment and wonder where the city administration led by Klish was.


Electrification of the railway line between Tel Aviv and Jerusalem - 08/07/2018 (photo - Yaron Karmi)
"We prevented serious damage to the landscape, which could have been created in the alternative that Klish supported"
Electrification of the railway line between Tel Aviv and Jerusalem - 08/07/2018 (photo - Yaron Karmi)

"Childish mistake - Klish believes them..."

In order to advance their goal, they proposed to carry out the overhead electrification temporarily, along Haifa's coastline, severely damaging the landscape, and in the next step they would sink the tracks along the existing coastal route. And Klish believes them! and presents it as a victory!!
This is a really childish mistake that shows a lack of understanding and lack of judgment. Because no one will invest billions in "temporary" electrification! How can a grown man believe that? The railway management just found a sucker.

And even if they were willing to invest, it's impossible anyway, for the following reasons:

  1. During the works, the trains to the north will be paralyzed for several years, do you think the residents of the north and their leaders will agree?
  2. Their travel time to the center will remain too long because of the detour around Haifa.
  3. The route itself is full of obstacles on the way, infrastructures, cemeteries, requires climbing bridges, going down tunnels, a real roller coaster! Now following our appeals that were accepted, our alternatives will be discussed more seriously, and maybe the municipalities will also sober up and realize the mistake of Klish.
"Infinite obstacles in the route of the settlement promoted by Klish"
The Hasmona train station and the railroad (photo - Yaron Karmi)

Tunneling or sinking the train - decision on the appeals of Dvir Langer, Shmuel Galbhart and Adam Teva and Din 20/01/22


contact: At watsapBy email

Samar Odeh - Carantinji
Samar Odeh - Carantinji
Journalist in the team of correspondents of the Chai Pe site • Municipal reporter, crimes, environment and health Contact Samar by email: [email protected]

Articles related to this topic

59 תגובות

  1. sad..
    No wonder the Ministry of Transport stopped the trains
    At night to Haifa from Tabeg.

  2. It would be significantly better to create a railway that would come from the north, stop at Lev Hamfaretz central station (the hub of all traffic in the northwest of the country) and from there continue south with roads 75-70-67 and then connect to the existing coastal railway, basically bypassing Carmel from the east without long tunnels.
    More areas will also get a high-speed train, the train will also be faster (a less crooked route and with fewer stops) and it will also be cheaper than all the alternatives that were proposed that included a tunnel.

  3. What is the point of this tunnel? It barely shortens the travel time, still makes an odd detour to get to the subway. It is already possible to simply follow the Ministry of Transportation's proposal (much, much, much cheaper) to keep the same route that exists today and just lower it a few meters underground. That's how suddenly the coastline is not blocked (the main argument of Adam Teva and Din).

    If to dig a tunnel, then a direct one from the Carmel beach to the heart of the bay. In Mila, the location of the existing stations is quite bad and causes you to stop too often. If one wants to continue further to the underground city then he can take a non-express or metro train.

  4. Regarding the last commenter, "Haifai - we will put things on the table", in my opinion you clarified the "problem" in the correct way (the Ministry of Transportation would prefer a tunnel from the rowers/magadis directly to the central bay without providing a tunnel solution in the western part of the city); In my opinion, of course, such a tunnel (Sdera tunnel) is excellent for Haifa, but that is not the point.

    The point is that some solution to this problem/concern needs to be provided. What do you do in the given situation?

    The solution I propose (and there may be other solutions) is to force the Ministry of Transportation first of all, within the framework of TL65A, to tunnel the western axis (Stadium-Kiryat Havalet) or (Stadium-Kiryat Eliezer - Kiryat Havalet) or (Stadium-Hivoriv somewhat according to the thesis of Eyal), that is, it doesn't matter at the moment which route you choose - the western route.

    The meaning is that, in my opinion, we should now fight to change the "split point" of the plans, that is to say that Tel 65a will end at Kiryat Yavlat (or in Heroes) and not at the Carmel Beach station. This is the main point. The split point is wrong and harmful to Haifa.

    Along with this, the Haifa municipality should actually support a long tunnel to the central part of the bay (the Sedara tunnel), because such a tunnel will lead to the evacuation of the petrochemical industry from the bay (and will be a catalyst for the arrival of a knowledge-rich industry). And it would also be a refreshing change if the Haifa municipality would say for once what is yes, and not just what is not.

    Therefore, it would have been appropriate for the Haifa municipality to insist on the above solution, and place the above solution as a condition regarding electrification.

    It is also necessary to understand, that TL 65a and TL 65b, are separate (and independent), and both projects are a national priority, therefore there is actually a possibility that they will be carried out.

    It is clear that there is exposure that the western axis tunnel will not happen, but this is the best way to "force" the Ministry of Transport to carry out the western axis tunnel.

    • exterminate,

      I don't see how the Avenue Tunnel will move Bezan or benefit Haifa. I see how it cuts off the city from the train. If there is one station that is half an hour away from most parts of the city and in the opposite direction to the movement of most passengers, it is as if there is no station at all. Haifa too Losing 3 stops on the spot. It's quite mind-boggling that this sounds good to someone. After all, no problem. But everyone who is now cursing Klish and praising this ethics should understand very well what it is about - disconnecting Haifa from the train.

      All the stories with "the municipality needs to force the Ministry of Transport and the railway" are quite startling. Didn't Eitan blame Klish for exactly that? That she did exactly that and therefore the Ministry of Transportation is taking revenge on the city? It's just that in the case of the airport the municipality had real tools to bend their hands, in this case - no. And for that matter, it didn't work at the airport either because no one bothered to extend the runway at the end despite the promises.

    • In my opinion, Klish is right on this issue, but you have to choose the wars. The idiotic waiver of the Carmel Ridge Matron, which was budgeted by Kahlon for NIS 3 billion, is something I still can't explain to this day. So is the unnecessary fight about the cable car (which, by the way, on the merits of the matter I agree with the cliché that it is a white elephant). The Ministry of Finance is giving Haifa a budget of billions in an unprecedented way, they are not going to throw it into the sea in a second (and it is clear to everyone that any minister who is not Kahlon, who has a connection to Haifa, was not so generous).
      Here the situation is different. To move a kilometer-long tunnel through Haifa's municipal territory, which is a big project anyway, is something that is very difficult to do when the municipality opposes and puts its feet up, and I believe that the Ministry of Transportation will not get involved in such a thing in the first place. And such a "boulevard tunnel", unlike other things, is really a real disaster for Haifa.

    • You state that this is a "separation of Haifa from the train" when the proposal is that there will be 6 train stations in Haifa (Kiryat Shmuel, Kiryat Haim, Chutz Ha'Faretz, Central Ha'Faretz, Kiryat Shmuel, Stadium/Mtm)

    • to Ethan,

      It must be said that despite an unimaginable amount of deliberate black PR of the Haifa sites, if you look at the merits of the matter, most of Klish's decisions are correct and logical. In particular, I really disagree with you about the Matron of the Carmel Ridge. The problem is that due to the topographical structure of Haifa, Moriah axis is not only a source and a destination, but also the only road that connects many places to many other places. The matron on this route is actually line 37, very much cut at the cost of dictionaries, when it arrives at the expense of all the lines that use the Carmel ridge - I'm willing to bet on The eldest sons within the framework of this line would cancel or divert a significant part of the existing lines that are among the strongest lines in Haifa (37, 28, 133, etc.) - as they did in _all_ the other places. Instead, they would instead propose to make a "short exchange" for an absolute majority of Use these lines. No, thanks.

      BRT is more suitable for long routes that do not make sense to expect them to be linked by a direct line, a kind of backbone. The Carmel Ridge is not like that. Besides being a destination in itself, it links all parts of the city and creating a "backbone" at the expense of this role was only Harms public transport users.

      What's more, it would have been most appropriate to remove all the parking from the Moriah axis, because why is there a parking lot there that only monitors the traffic, and create a bicycle path and a road sign. This is something that could have been useful.

    • exterminate,

      With all due respect to Kiryat Shmuel and Kiryat Haim, they are not really a replacement for about 90% of the city's residents who live south of the Peretz. It's like proposing to cancel the Savidor, HaShalom and Hagana stations and saying that from now on the Holon Junction and Herzliya will be the stations that serve Tel Aviv. clearly improbable. The Bay Center is a more reasonable option, but for the 300 residents of Haifa who do not include Kiryat Haim and Kiryat Shmuel, it is in the opposite direction to the destination of the vast majority (Tel Aviv) and extends the trip by about half an hour.

      The stadium/MTAM is a replacement for the Carmel beach which has no residential hinterland. This means that it must include parking and a very strong array of buses from all parts of the city. The problem is that there is no chance that such a station will be established at the Mattam intersection. simply does not exist. If Harchemel beach is moved, it will be moved south from the stadium towards a castle with a huge parking lot. Not far from a central station and metro station but too big for walking. Unless a central station also moves there, this is an intolerable harm to the convenience of using the train.

      Which leaves the "Kiryat Shvarat". that she will have to drain all the users of the center of the eight and Bat Galim. It is not really clear how this is possible because there is no place for a large station there and there is also no place for supplementary transportation. Yes yes, a matron who is a matron and a Carmelite who is a Carmelite. But these two do not provide a real answer to the absolute majority of the city's residents. The bus system that exists today directly links only the neighborhoods below and the kilometer of Carmelit. One can dream, of course, that the bus system will change and there will be direct buses from all parts of the city - but I don't believe it. On the one hand, there is no place for a bus terminal there, and on the other hand, there is no axis that goes down from the Carmel, so that every route there will become tortuous, long and inefficient (unlike Bet Galim, where there is a terminal and two main axes from the Carmel in addition to the Independence axis). What will actually happen is a drop in the level of service and the idea that everyone will simply switch to the matron - something that people hate to do and will therefore see this station as less convenient.

      But as mentioned, in my opinion, all of this is only theoretical because in practice there will be a suburban overhead line that will travel with all the stops and with a low frequency, and a line that passes over Haifa directly to Tel Aviv and that sounds like a real damage to the city to me. Yes yes, he will stop in Kiryat Shmuel, thank you very much.

      I personally would think it would make the most sense to make a stop at the Grand Canyon (as suggested by Eyal? Ethan?) and route all traffic there. Yes, there is no real residential hinterland either, but it is a central location with a large bus station and a set of direct roads from all parts of the city. It's annoying to go through the mall, but maybe we can find a solution for that too. But if you say that it is not possible in terms of the angle of the rail, then this option is also ruled out. If so, the option of the Haifa municipality is the best, which gives a compromise between a convenient train connection and access to the sea. If because of you what I'm sure will happen - this human damage to the city will be on your conscience.

  5. Eyal,
    According to our alternative, which the train adopted, an underground station would be built under Pel-Yam Street, between the missile building and the courthouse, and up to Paris Square in the west (previously the train talked about the station on Nathanson Street, but it abandoned it),
    Regarding the thought of adding trains along the Carmel Tunnels route, the slope on this route is not suitable for a train. It goes without saying that trains cannot be added inside the tunnels themselves.

    • I have to agree with Eyal here, alternative 11 seems no less problematic than alternative 102 which was approved, and what can actually happen is the promotion of alternative 9 and the blocking of the other alternatives. It is forbidden under any circumstances to allow a high-speed train that passes through the municipal territory of Haifa and does not stop at at least two stations - the bay and the Carmel beach (and this is if we include the damage to Bat Galim and Kiryat Government). With all due respect to Kiryat and the northern settlements, there is no reason to allow high-speed trains that bypass Haifa - this would seriously harm its status (in addition to the fact that most passengers to Tel Aviv are from Haifa, more than all passengers from the north combined). If in the north they want a train that bypasses Haifa, let them connect to the eastern rail and then there won't be any problem. Bypassing Haifa is just like bypassing Tel Aviv...

    • Want to know why the train adopted it? Because they are not going to do it under any circumstances. The only reason why they agreed to make a tunnel according to the Haifa municipality's plan is that there is no physical space to build two more railways on the existing route. As soon as they get permission to dig alternative 9, _no one_ will make another expensive and cumbersome tunnel that costs billions of shekels to open the sea or make life better for the residents of Haifa. What will happen is that there will be fast trains passing through Haifa that stop only at the Gulf center and slow trains that will stop at all the stations and they will go over the existing tracks only with electric poles. point. Fight me.

    • I completely agree with the last writer, that it is possible that the Israel Railways is sketching alternatives for a tunnel in the western part of the city without any intention of carrying it out, and when it becomes possible, it will carry out alternative 9, a direct tunnel to the Gulf Central. This is the biggest challenge we face now. Therefore, a united front of the North and Haifa against the Ministry of Transportation is required here. Otherwise, there is a high probability that the Sedara tunnel will be built (which, in my opinion, is excellent for Haifa, because it is the basis for evacuating the polluting industry from the Gulf, and also does not "bypass" Haifa, despite the fact that there are those who do not recognize Kiryat Shmuel, Kiryat Haim and Chutz Ha'Faretz as part of the city of Haifa)

    • again. Let's put things on the table please.

      Israel Railways is _not_ going to do anything that benefits the residents of Haifa unless it benefits its plans. This is true for both the Treasury and the Ministry of Transport. How many decades have all these struggles been going on? Airport? The sea front? Sinking of the rails? Episode Kishon? Evacuation in Zan? Nothing moved and nothing happened, neither at Yahav's nor at Kalish's. The only thing that succeeded was Kalish's war against blocking the airport, when she forcefully forced the Ministry of Transportation to leave a chance to expand the route, even though Haifa received the Revenge in the form of damage to beautiful scenery.

      So back to our business - the only reason they started talking about sinking the tracks and developing the sea front is not because anyone cares about Haifa, but because the railway has its own plans that include doubling the tracks and this plan is not possible on the existing route without sinking the track. This is the reason why we suddenly got the sea front and the promised subsidence (I don't know if it's possible, DA) and really not the pressure of the residents, the power of the municipality and nothing else. It's because the railway has changed plans and in order to realize them it manages to promote plans that benefit the city.

      Because of your site it goes to waste. From the moment that alternative 9 opens, the train has no interest in touching these tracks anymore, neither the Treasury nor the Ministry of Transport. And no "united front" that isn't going to happen because the North doesn't care if Haifa has access to the sea or not, won't help you. Just like she didn't help until now and for the past ten years, just like she didn't help with the settlement and didn't help with the airport and not with Bezan and with nothing else. With your own hands because of your war Nash Klish you robbed Haifa of this chance. So now you won't be Not the sea front, not the subsidence of the track and not tunneling. Whatever it will be is an elevated track with electrification and a tunnel for high-speed trains that the residents of the north will enjoy and the residents of Haifa will not.

    • I agree with Haifai, except for the part about Klish. One of the main reasons for the mess in this whole thing is the relationship it destroyed with the Ministry of Transportation, and turned this city from a powerhouse into a wretched village.
      The explanation of Kiryat Shmuel, Kiryat Haim and the Gulf crossing is ridiculous with all due respect, still an absolute majority of the Haifa area was knocked out of alternative 9. There is no dispute about that at all.
      Regarding alternative 9 - I think the municipality has a lot of power on the issue. If it stands on its hind legs and informs the Ministry of Transportation unequivocally that they will forget about any alternative that bypasses Haifa, they will not rush to approve it. It's not just any project, it's a mega project of mining a long tunnel, most of which runs through the municipal territory of Haifa, the municipality can stall it for years, delay it and screw up the whole project - it's hard for me to see the Ministry of Transportation and the railway embarking on such a war in which it is clear that they will also lose. What's more, the district committee also understands that any alternative that bypasses Haifa is completely out of the question.
      It's time to learn from the Tel Aviv municipality how to work.

  6. Eitan / Eyal Hello, following your comments -

    Fast and direct trains to Tel Aviv will be both from the east of the city (alternative 9) and from the west of the city (alternative 11).

    The tracks between the stadium and the Government Kiryat are "shared" for fast equipment and suburban equipment.

    In total, about 13 trains per hour can leave from Kiryat Shvarem to the stadium (according to alternative 11).

    We are talking about 5 high-speed trains per hour from Kiryat Shvarel and the stadium to Tel Aviv (about 27 minutes). (By the way, the intention is not to stop at the university station). The maximum allowed is 6-7 high-speed trains per hour from the stadium.

    Alternative 9 is about 9 high-speed trains per hour to Tel Aviv. Some will make a stop at Hadera and some will be direct. There is another war going on about this.

    It is clear that the final operational characterization is flexible, and will be determined according to the number of passengers of course.

    This layout (9+11) creates a maximum shortening of passenger time while providing a solution for both intra-metropolitan trips (as Eyal described earlier) and trips between the metropolises. Let's just mention that this plan is focused on travel between the metropolises and not on travel between Nahariya and Hadera or between Tirat Carmel and Acre (which are actually within the Haifa metropolis).

    • That is, from the stadium to Tel Aviv: about 6 fast trains per hour + about 7 suburban trains per hour

    • Dvir Where exactly is there a place for a train to exit the tunnel in Kiryat Shvarat? In my opinion, Gelbart is once again coming up with an imaginary scenario that has no planning behind it (and not for the first time.. there were several of these when he was deputy mayor and head of the local committee and that's how several more hazards were born in Haifa).
      Kiryat Havrat should be a mixed-use district that includes offices, government offices, recreation and residences. You don't need the center train and not a hole (where??) with fast trains through it. If Galbhart's intention is in Wadi Salib, that is ridiculous, there is no way to connect the rails to a check post from there
      In the route of the existing Carmel tunnels, there are three advantages: both saving maximum travel time and still going through Haifa, there is also a way to easily connect to the Hav Check Post, and for the first time in the history of Haifa there is a station that will serve the 150 thousand residents of Carmel without long trips to the stations today: full feasibility To establish a station at the bottom of Wadi HaGivori with a metro line from it in Wadi (on the existing axis of Nahal Gigivor Road) exactly five minutes to Kiryat Havrat.
      I have a hard time understanding how such an alternative has not come up and is not agreed upon by everyone. It is the most economical, the most logical and the most applicable.
      It should be understood that there is no reason to push a train either to the Bat Galim area or to the Kiryat Havrat area. The situation today is a serious planning error that harms the development of Haifa, an inheritance from the Hijaz railway and the British mandate. We are not obligated to leave such historical mistakes and the land values ​​as soon as the railway along the coast and through Haifa are removed in all those neighborhoods will skyrocket and finance the entire project from land marketing.
      There is also no way to really open up the urban seafront instead of the Haifa port at its anchorage without the complete removal of the railroad tracks that separate the city from the water line. and put rails and a train into the Government Kiryat or its surroundings (again, I don't know how this is even technically possible)
      It's creating a new hazard in place of the one we removed.
      The bottom of Wadi HaGivori, which after the Carmel tunnels is Wadi Mofar in this area (the Grand Canyon) will create the possibility of an intermediate station that Haifa longs for - the possibility of going down from very populated neighborhoods even on foot to the train station. Romema (20 thousand inhabitants), Neve Shanan (60 thousand inhabitants) and Vizhnitz and Hadar (40 thousand inhabitants). Each such neighborhood is like an entire city. So one can understand the importance of creating a station in the center of these neighborhoods, far above Kiryat Shvarmet, which is also easily accessible by a flat and fast subway line.
      I see in my vision a public figure from Jerusalem who needs to meet at Kiryat Havlat, arrives from Tel Aviv by high-speed train, goes up at the Wadi HaGivori station to the matron platform, travels the spectacular route through Huadi to the Migdal Havlat station for 5 minutes, after the meeting they take a matron for five minutes to Bat Galim and sit in the marina at a restaurant for lunch. At the end, a matron returned, he said goodbye to his friend who is returning to work in Kiryat Shvarat, continues in a matron to Migdal Meta Hoof for a meeting in the afternoon and in a matron back to the Wadi HaGivuri station to take a train to Tel Aviv.
      Someone try to give me a better vision than this for the development of Haifa.

    • Dvir is in all seriousness: the line marked as circle 11 has no physical feasibility in the field. A tunnel is about 3 or 4 times more expensive on the marked route, there is no where to connect to Kiryat Havrat (the place where it is marked as exiting to Kiryat Havrat or Central Haifa, this is an area built entirely today of neighborhoods. This is planning without feasibility and without planning.
      The only realistic alternative is on the route of the Carmel tunnels. I really don't even understand how it is possible to promote alternative 11 without any possibility and an imaginary tunnel through the tunnels through the whole of Haifa about 2 times longer than the Carmel tunnels to Petah that will exit where exactly? In the middle of citrus?
      Leave it, no serious. The alternative through Wadi HaGivorum is not only serious and possible, it will also serve the majority of Haifa neighborhoods.

    • That is, disconnection of Haifa city center from the train.

      The Shumana center station and the Bat Galim station serve about a million passengers each year. Until there is a city where a train station is accessible
      On foot/by bus, so now it's closed? seriously? We will once again go to "Rosh Ha'in West" which takes longer to reach than to get from Haifa to Tel Aviv?

      But overall, it doesn't really worry me. So it is true that Haifa will be weakened as a result because the Kiryats will be connected more quickly to Tel Aviv than to Haifa, and thus the city will lose its status. But in practice, as we understand very well, if ever under any circumstances someone allows alternative 9, what will actually happen is that high-speed trains will bypass Haifa completely, and the existing track will be electrified and will remain that way forever. No one will move or tunnel - because why? The train will get its 4 tracks (2 electrified overpasses around the city and 2 tunnels that go over Haifa in general), it has no reason to invest and start expensive and complicated developments. That's the only thing you got (maybe).

  7. The Carmel Beach train station must be moved from the beach. The rail tunnel and moving the station will lead to the development of a huge quality area in front of Dado Beach and with the evacuation of the base north of the station it is an area the size of Bat Galim!!! In fact it will make it possible to establish a second quality neighborhood in front of the sea with hotels and apartment towers. This is what the train and the base there are stealing today.
    It is not possible to evacuate bases only in the center and in Tel Aviv... the residents of Haifa demand that this huge area in front of the sea be returned to Haifa!!

  8. I'm already confused by all the alternatives. Indeed, the removal of the train from the coast is very desirable, but the most important principle, which must not be compromised, is that the high-speed line to Tel Aviv must pass through Haifa in at least two stations - the Gulf Center and the Carmel Beach. If possible, also in the Government Building or alternatively at a new train station in the Grand Canyon as already suggested here (or anywhere else on the Carmel halfway, depending on the route of the tunnel). It is forbidden in any way to allow a bypass of Haifa by means of a Sedara tunnel that will exit at Magadim, it will be killed and not passed. There is no such thing as a train to Tel Aviv passes through the center of the bay but not at the Carmel beach (or at the station on the Carmel), and goes straight to the Atlit area. With all due respect to the north, the main goal is to connect Haifa to Tel Aviv, that's the main load.

    • right. Especially since a large part of the transportation from the north to Tel Aviv is to the airport, and as soon as there is a field in the north and it is clear that there will be, it is not a question of whether, then the need will go on and on, while a large part of the trips from Haifa are for work purposes and it is essential that all the fast lines to Tel Aviv pass through the Carmel Beach central station and it is also desirable At the middle station in Wadi and also at Check Post and from there to the Karyot Central. Residents of the Karyot will split between going to the Karyot Central or the Check Post Central. Residents of East Haifa will travel to the Carmel Beach Central or the Wadi Givorim Central.
      In this way, almost the entire metropolis between the Kiryat and Haifa and Shefaim / Tel Aviv will be covered.
      In my opinion, the stoppage is a mistake. The line should be at 160 km/h Nahariya - Acre - Check Post - Carmel - HaCarmel Beach and from there 250 km/h without stopping to Tel Aviv University and Tel Aviv Center. In between the direct speed, you can make a speed-intermediate stop with one intermediate stop in Herzliya or Hadera.

  9. Bat Galim train station is completely unnecessary and devours space on which 1,000 apartments can be built. There are metro routes from the Carmel beach to Bat Galim and it is possible to establish an exclusive metro route in the area of ​​shared tracks that will reach Bat Galim in 6 minutes.. You don't need any train around the beach and no imaginary subsidence

    • Bat Galim train station is a station that serves 1.2 million passengers a year and is the 20th busiest station among all Israel Railways stations. To say she is unnecessary... wow

    • If the Bat Galim station is so important, then why is the Haifa municipality in favor of moving the Bat Galim station to Kiryat Eliezer?

      What solution will there be for the navy base, Rambam and the residents of the Bat Galim neighborhood?

    • According to the plan, from what I saw, the Kiryat Eliezer station is a 5-minute walk from the existing Bat Galim station. That's why it's not going to change anything for those coming to Rambam or the Navy base. It's also within walking distance of tens of thousands of residents of the area.

      It is enough to treat the infrastructures as hazards that should be kept as far away as possible. Anyone who has ever visited Europe or even Tel Aviv has seen how convenient it is when the train station is in the city center. Therefore, it is simply mind-boggling that the same people are not able to throw the same conclusions on Haifa and are looking for any way to leave it without an effective train service.

  10. As a response to the last commenter (the issue of Bat Galim and proximity to the bus station), we will refer as follows:
    1. It is possible, and it was suggested, to consider "Alternative 12", which will pass through Kiryat Eliezer (the use of the term "Bat Galim" is another deception by the city engineer; the municipality does not offer a station in Bat Galim either; the station in Kiryat Eliezer will already be much less attractive from the existing station at Bat Galim, and many would prefer to travel to Rambam by e.g. the matron.) Therefore, the claim regarding Bat Galim is irrelevant. To the essence of the claim, the crossing at Kiryat Eliezer will harm all users of the Carmelite, and will harm the desire of the Haifa municipality to strengthen the "sea front" in the vicinity of Kiryat Havlam. Therefore , adding a station in Kiryat Eliezer will harm the residents of Haifa first and foremost. Once again, the municipality will be able to insist on the losing alternative to adding a station in Kiryat Eliezer (and continue to mislead in the coming discussions. The residents of the north, who I represent, will probably not oppose alternative 12, But government ministries, led by the Treasury and the Prime Minister's Office, will definitely oppose (in view of the additional cost of about 1 billion NIS and the damage to the economic benefit that I described above).
    2. Regarding the continued location of the Carmel Coast train station on the beach in view of the proximity to the bus center: a. All the bus lines pass through the Matam intersection anyway, so the claim is not really clear (and if there was a bus line that does not pass through the Matam intersection, it would be possible to characterize the line so that it would indeed pass through the Matam intersection, continue to the central station, and from there go on its way); B. Also In Azrieli, you get off the train and are not required to take the "shuttle" to the central station in Tel Aviv; third. The model of "buses" we are familiar with today is coming to an end, and we are moving to services such as "Tik-Tek", and other advanced/cooperative bus systems that will provide a solution in the urban area.

    • I very much respect your opinion because I see the desire to improve. But nothing you wrote is true.

      1. Bat Galim or K. Eliezer - it doesn't matter. The fact is that it is a station in the city center and accessible by foot for thousands of residents. The Carmel beach and Peretz have no residential hinterland, and anyone who wishes to use them must first use auxiliary transportation, which makes the stations less attractive. To give it up - is to give up the most attractive areas in terms of transportation. No matron will help. Travel time from Carmel Beach to Bat Galim by bus is 20 minutes, add another 10 minutes of waiting and changing. And here the road with the cancellation of the station is twice as long for those 2 passengers of the station. This is a direct violation of the transportation service.

      2. Moving the Carmel Beach station to the Matam intersection is definitely a good idea. The problem is that it's not going to happen. The Matam intersection is already busy and building something there is expensive and difficult. What is going to happen, of course, is that in order to simplify and save, this station will be built south of the stadium, where there are empty spaces. It is too far to walk and too isolated to create a transportation system strong enough to provide quick and direct access to the city. This will be another station outside the city that will extend the travel time by half an hour and will be inconvenient neither for those arriving at MTM nor for those leaving the city.

      3. To remind you, in Tel Aviv the central station has another train station - the Hagana, and there is also a very large bus terminal near Savidor. Azrieli is on the scale of Bat Galim and the center of the eight, and is so strong because it is within walking distance of strong attractions (HaKaria, Azrieli, Sharona, residential neighborhoods). In Haifa, the Gulf Central has no pull anchor and this is a station that tended to be replaced by a means of urban transportation; On the Carmel beach there is the MTAM (unless you move it to the stadium) but it is also only an intermediate station to change to the bus. A train station will be more convenient and attractive the closer it is to the final destination by walking for the maximum number of people. Canceling stations in the city and replacing them with a remote station without a hinterland This is a direct harm to both the transportation system and the city's quality of life.

      4. Based on what you wrote, I'm guessing that you don't really use Tiktok. The waiting time in them is half an hour during rush hours and fifteen minutes during the rest of the time. Similar ventures have already been closed in several cities in the world because they failed and I predict that they failed in Haifa as well - at least I gave up trying to use this service because it is inferior not only to a private car but even to a bus. But it is not fundamental. In any case, changing to another means of transportation is at least 10 minutes of walking and waiting, plus the travel time. All the advantage over a private car that a high-speed train gives is "eaten up" by an urban public transportation system. And the further the stations are from the population centers, the greater the weight of the loss of convenience and time.

  11. After all, Klish is right, and of course the article again tries to blacken her without referring to her arguments at all.

    Today there is a central station next to a train station. According to this plan, the train station will be separated from a central bus station ("with a link" - I wonder what that means, probably Telporter). In practice, this means that those who want to use the train will have to change buses, probably to some "shuttle" from Carmel Beach, which will extend the trip by at least 20 minutes. Not to mention the cancellation of the Bat Galim station, which serves more than a million passengers a year, whose journey will now be tens of minutes longer. This alternative may connect the city to the sea but disconnects it from the railway and harms Haifa as a metropolitan center.

  12. The mayor should come to the Ministry of Transportation and say this is what I want:
    1. You will tunnel the train in Haifa or we will block all electrification and we will not allow any electrification through the coast and the city - ever. Of course? No? So we will spend a quarter of a million residents to block these works that block our sea.
    2. You will move all the tracks and allow all of Haifa access to the sea and land for development instead of the huge area that the tracks take up today.
    3. You will stop with the high-speed trains at stations through Haifa and if you dare to completely bypass Haifa to the north in a tunnel, we will make sure to block it at the exit through Haifa, understood?
    4. All the railway works that close lines for days, weeks and weekends - the Ministry of Transport immediately puts half price discounted buses between the center and Haifa with a frequency of every half hour, and we don't care how much it will cost you to subsidize it.
    5. Airport in the north - immediately, decision on location. date. budgeting. Competitors for Israel. Not small, not medium. Competitors for Israel.
    Enough with the games.
    This is how to knock the sealed officials in Jerusalem until they realize that we are tired of being third class in this country.

    • Power without brains.
      will only result in further damage to the residents of Haifa and the north.
      We have already seen how the power of the Ministry of Transport is greater than that of Haifa, and see the Smotrich-Klish surrender agreement regarding the airport.
      In the proposed route, there will be electrification along the coast or complete cancellation of the train service through Bat Galim and central Haifa (and the provision of a tunnel solution bypassing these stations which will serve the national network).
      The proposed conduct is the same as Tzuklish's conduct, and is not the right way to proceed

  13. Cliche cliche, what did we sin that you are our mayor?
    You have degraded Haifa to a level I did not know.
    Only destruction, stagnation and neglect.
    Even the airport that was your lottery ticket to the mayorship was abandoned and destroyed.
    What else do you want to destroy that you haven't been able to in the last two years?

    • Power without brains.
      will only result in further damage to the residents of Haifa and the north.
      We have already seen how the power of the Ministry of Transport is greater than that of Haifa, and see the Smotrich-Klish surrender agreement regarding the airport.
      In the proposed route, there will be electrification along the coast or complete cancellation of the train service through Bat Galim and Central Haifa (and the provision of a tunnel solution bypassing these stations which will serve the national network).
      The proposed conduct is the same as Tzuklish's conduct, and is not the right way to proceed

  14. The vision of the Haifa Carmel train station in Nahal HaGivurim. Impressions from a visitor from Vienna who returns to Haifa in a decade:
    "In 2022. A decade ago, when I visited a friend in Neve Shanan who teaches at the Technion, I got off at the Carmel beach and from there the bus took 40 minutes after an hour's train ride. This time in Israel I had the impression that a big change had taken place: I drove for about half an hour to a new station that is reached by tunnels under Mount Carmel. It is located At the bottom of Wadi. The platforms are below it, and a matron rapid bus platform is one floor above it. The view was spectacular. Large glass windows let the view of the green mountain and the sky into the underground platforms. Transparent elevators in front of the view brought us up to the matron floor. The elevator continued and went up 10 floors to a parking garage that told For us, this is the largest emergency parking lot in the Middle East and could be used by thousands of residents in an earthquake. It's a good idea. Above it are the floors of a bicycle parking lot. And above it are the floors of the bus station. There were several restaurants on the lower floor of the bus station. And a glass bridge where we walked on a conveyor belt that connected us to a huge mall, the Grand Canyon. All the while, we looked out over the Huadi landscape opposite. Vehicular bridges, and a pedestrian bridge with a futuristic design to the towers on the other side of Huadi. Below us, tall tropical palms planted inside the station between the floors created a spectacular garden that could be seen from all the floors of this huge station. After we wandered through the mall and found a place To eat, we went back across the bridge to the bus station. It's so comfortable. There the friend rang us and said he had a surprise, tickets to a concert at Romma Hall! We put our luggage in the lockers at the station, he said it was just a short walk. We were instructed to go up to the roof of the station, where a pedestrian bridge called "Ha-Gesher Laramma" connected us with a boardwalk towards the temple. We saw cyclists coming to the station on this bridge in front of us and others riding on it from the station back from work. After ten minutes we were at Romema Hall where we met him and saw a performance. We were impressed by such good and convenient public transportation, that you don't need a car at all, and this big new station with so much is a must-stop for every tourist in Israel. Where do you live now, I asked because it wasn't the address from a decade ago. 'The mall you were in has two new residential towers above it, it is very convenient for me, because I teach at the Technion but work in the north, and take a train from the station,' he said. "And where does your child study?" we asked. "Ah, the beautiful bridge you saw to the other side of Huadi, every morning I take the child on a bike to school in Neve Shanan and return to the station."

  15. I'm counting the days, that Mrs. Klish will fly away from the poor, the worst mayor that Haifa has ever had, everything is neglected, pigs everywhere, and there's no one to talk to, the right hand doesn't know immediately Small, the plan to move a tunnel from the Carmel beach, to the government wall, for the train, simply genius

  16. It is not relevant and has nothing to do with the residents of Haifa, we are talking about things that will happen in 50 years....

  17. It's good that there are mature people who can correct the nonsense that a cliché does

    • The Ahithophel advisers of Klish caused enormous damage here.
      A tunnel for the train should have been presented immediately, and the evacuation of the entire coastal strip for planning, something that would finance the costs of the tunnel from the marketing of the land
      That the track will turn along the whole of Haifa. After all, this is what we dreamed would happen, so why did the municipality and Yahav the Fools suddenly sign an imaginary settlement
      Let's say, like Messiah, they will bring us 13 billion shekels for subsidence and even overcome groundwater along the entire underground at the beach (something that is overcome with great difficulty in the small Rambam parking lot). of the train. That means we will be left with a huge empty space through the whole of Haifa where nothing can be built. So what did we do with it.
      Just a tunnel!!

  18. Imagine this reality: 2028. The mayor of Haifa inaugurates the new train tunnels and the two new train stations. On Simcha Golan Road, the designed pedestrian bridge was inaugurated between the station entrance in the direction of Romema and Neve Shanan. At Check Post, the train tunnel comes out of the mountain like the Carmel tunnels and connects to the Check Post station. At the same time, the mayor inaugurates the new matron line on Nahal HaGivori road that connects the underground station to the police tower and the government building.
    Michael lives on Hanita Street and works in Acre. Used to leave early with the car, and drive back and forth to Acre. Michael now rides his bicycle from Hanita Street 2 minutes to the Wadi Givorim bridge, crosses Huadi and arrives at the train station parking lots. He parks the bicycle on the bicycle parking level of the station. In the large elevators, dozens of people from the car parks, the elite bus station and pedestrians and bicycles descend with him to the train station. The elevator doors open at the underground platform. The sign shows that in 5 minutes the train will arrive from Menhariya, Kiryut, the check post. And at the platform opposite, the train will arrive north to Check Post, Kiryat, Acre and Nahariya. Michael gets on the train to the north. He left the car at home, it is much more convenient to get to Acre now from Mano Shanan by train.
    Ruti, a resident of Romma, remembers the exhausting 3-minute car ride to the Carmel Beach train with her friends to go to Tel Aviv and then look for parking there! And then take the congested Freud to Carmel at the end of the day... Now, they drive XNUMX minutes down to the parking lot of the Wadi HaGivori station, enter the elevator, go down to the station and go directly to Tel Aviv.

  19. Why is there no reference in the article to the costs of the various alternatives and the duration of the works?

    Anyone can offer alternatives.

  20. This is not a loss for Kalish, it is a victory for the residents of Haifa.

    • This is not a loss for Kalish, it is a loss for the residents of Haifa.
      Thanks to these attractions we can "enjoy" both worlds: both inferior train service and railways in front of the sea.

  21. A. The main barrier between the sea and Haifa is not the railway tracks, but a road with 6 lanes.
    B. Skipping the Bat Galim station that transports thousands of people to their place of work in Rambam and the naval bases. Mischaga.
    third. Already today it is impossible to get to the government building during rush hours. This is a bottleneck that there is no way to release because of historical buildings. A train station will only worsen the situation and add vehicle traffic on the unfortunate axis of Independence Street.
    third. parking? A connection to Carmel? The government case, how?

    • Here are answers to everything you posted:
      A. A road is not a barrier. On the way to Hagana, the matron passes, and there are and are planned footbridges over it. This barrier is 5 meter high railway fences and electricity poles and a hill with 4 railway tracks that will also destroy a significant part of Hecht Park (everything is "temporary" of course..temporary for decades)
      on. The matron that is on the Hagana road enters Bat Galim and it will be possible to add even another matron only station instead of the railway. Let's remember that the heavy train is today a huge hazard to Bat Galim: noise, acoustic walls, blocking the neighborhood in front of Kiryat Eliezer, the station areas and the tracks (which will only increase If 2 lines are added above the ground, Bat Galim will bloom when the train is in bloom.
      third. We don't need a train station in Kiryat Havmet and anyway the Galbart proposal talks about an underground station. There is nothing to do with the loads today and the government building is served by Carmelit, a matron. If you take the Tamhor train on the route of the Carmel Tunnels as I suggested, it will be served by a matron from there, similar to the Nahal HaGivuri road: exit the train station near the Grand Canyon, to the area of ​​Adam Square, the police station tower, and from there turn left and continue to Kiryat HaVelmet - exactly 5 minutes drive!! In such a tunnel alternative, the resident of Carmel did not go down by car to Kiryat Shrovetide. He will park his car in the parking lot of the Nahal Givorim train station, take the elevator down to the train station in the basement, where a matron line 5 will be waiting from the train station and the Grand Canyon through the police tower directly to Kiryat Havrat. There will be no reason for a Romema resident, for example, to get off in a car. Parking in the train parking lot in Simcha Golan + matron 5 minutes to Kiryat Havlat.
      This also answers your question D about the connection to Carmel. In my opinion, the railway tunnel with a station at the bottom of Nahal Givorim and an elevator like the Navon station in Jerusalem up to the Simcha Golan level, will be an amazing link between the national railway and the Carmel and Hadar ridges. A resident of Hadar will arrive by bus in 5 minutes through Geula to Derech Simcha Golan. Will go down in the elevator 2 minutes to the train station at the bottom of Huadi. And from there half an hour fast train to Tel Aviv. What's more than that?

  22. One only has to wonder how it is possible that Klish supported with all her advisers an alternative that would perpetuate electrification along the coastline for decades. An alternative to subsidence that we know from the problem of the groundwater in the Rambam parking lot - that it is simply not possible to dig a subsidence of 4 tracks for tens of kilometers and it will never happen, how come all its consultants and the city engineer support the destruction of Carmel Beach into a monstrous station that will shut down the lines to the north for years.
    Just explain to me what absurd arguments she brings to justify a rail route that adds 15 minutes to the drive just today. When there is the matron on this route anyway. When the vision is that Check Post instead of petrochemicals will have huge neighborhoods for tens of thousands of residents who will enjoy a direct link to the center of the country. When the government happens to check post, you arrive by matron in a few minutes and you don't need a heavy train at all.
    Explain to me how her advisors supported this. How come they didn't tell her, "It's clear to you that only a tunnel is something that is technically possible?" "It is clear to you that leaving the electrification along the coast will be a cry for generations." "It is clear to you that there is no chance of sinking 4 lines with groundwater and fuel pipelines that run along the coast" "It is clear to you that the tunnel alternative will also better serve the vision of developing the check post instead of the polluters"
    Can't understand how Klish and her advisors can't understand.
    The tunnel alternative has all the advantages. An alternative to electrification and in the future someday ever a complicated sedimentation has all the disadvantages.
    Even if we assume that 4 tracks along the coast will be sunk in the future, the railway will resist building any kind of construction over this huge sunken section.
    That is, it will be a casual "dead band" above which nothing can be done. Do you understand this??? Only a tunnel is a realistic alternative - and that's what Klish Waterman opposed?? how????

  23. What about a tunnel or from the Rambam junction up to Route 22 and save all the traffic jams, what about unloading the trucks from Route 22 during rush hour

  24. It is important to clarify the failure of the Haifa municipality here.

    There is now no obstacle because in the future discussion that will be held, "alternative 9" will also be discussed, the "Shidra tunnel", a long tunnel (9.5 km) from the center of the bay to the coastal railway a little north of Atlit.

    That is, it is certainly possible that in the additional discussion the Lutel will choose to advance the boulevard tunnel (alternative 9), but the Lutel has no ability to force the Ministry of Transportation to promote a planning alternative that the Ministry is not interested in promoting.

    Therefore, it could very well happen that we will be left with a beautiful drawing of 4 elevated railways in Haifa, when in practice the existing railways will remain on the coast, and only one tunnel will be advanced, according to alternative 9 (Sdera Tunnel). This is exactly the direction in which the Ministry of Transportation is striving in my opinion, and the words were said in the discussion in a relatively explicit way.

    This is what the representative of the Ministry of Transportation stated at the Botal discussion on 13.12.2021: "The Bay of Innovation suddenly shifts the focus, suddenly it's hard for us to say that the city center is in the Kiryat HaVelmet area. ... If they approve tomorrow, I say, it's hard to say, but if tomorrow they approve the Bay of Innovation, this issue of what the metropolitan center is, again, it starts to get more complex." And those who understand will understand.

    • Hello Dvir. The alternative that I am presenting also eliminates the "arch" required to reach Kiryat Shrovet with a tunnel. Something that is not necessary at all as I explained. A station in Wadi HaGivori, which will be connected by a matron on the road through Nahal Givori to the police tower and from there another two minutes to Kiryat HaVelmet. This whole trip - 5 minutes by bus.
      The Sdera tunnel is a stupid thing like no other: it leaves all the mess of tracks around the coast, electrification for decades, an imaginary and impossible subsidence [only 13 billion shekels.. let's say...] and another cost of a Sdera tunnel that encroaches on the place where a train station is most needed
      And this is Wadi HaGivoriv, ​​which can serve all of Carmel, Nosh, and Hader better than any station along the coast or in the Haifa Bay
      Approving a highway tunnel also means much more expensive costs for a much longer tunnel.
      I simply cannot understand how an optimal alternative that serves everyone is not raised by the municipality, the Ministry of Transportation.
      The dream of having a train station near the Grand Canyon is something that, even in terms of environmental quality, is huge. Thousands of trips from Carmel to the train stations on the coast are unnecessary.
      From every point of view, this is an alternative that benefits everyone. Not a boulevard tunnel, nor a strange tunnel arch to the Government Palace, and it is also not clear where a train station can be built there. Only on the existing proven route of the Wadi HaGivuri like the Carmel tunnels, with a station in Wadi and from there metro lines to Kiryat Havlam and Bat Galim.

    • Eyal, do you understand that a total of 4 tracks are needed from Shfiim to the Gulf center? Two high-speed tracks and two more suburban tracks. Let's assume for a moment that we get the option of a station at "Heroes" and continue south, according to which route do you move two more tracks (102, 10, 11 , 9).

    • Hello again Eyal,

      Since there should be 4 tracks in the vicinity of Haifa, we believed that combining alternatives 9 (Sdera Tunnel) + 11 is the best.

      Regarding the Sdera tunnel, in our opinion it will strengthen Haifa and the north, and will actually enable the vision of a "green bay".

      Such a tunnel is not in conflict with one or another tunnel route in the western part of the city of Haifa.

      The cost of such a tunnel, including everything, about 5 billion NIS. The cost of a tunnel according to route 11, about 4 billion NIS.

      On the contrary, the great economic benefit expected from the Sdera tunnel (11 billion NIS according to the Parat procedure) makes it possible to justify budgeting for a tunnel of the western axis, according to each route (11, 10, heroes).

      The essential mistake of the Haifa municipality (and of many Haifa residents in the past) was to label the Sdera tunnel as "bypassing" or "skipping" Haifa; The Haifa city engineer turned it into a demagogic campaign, while misleading his superiors, but of course the responsibility rests with them.

      The attempt to block an optimal connection from the eastern side of the city of Haifa (through the Sedara tunnel) did a lot of damage to Haifa and the entire north.

      I definitely agree that geographically there is an interesting "heroes" environment. The problem is that in the meantime the main urban center has developed to be in the Government Kiryat (including the promoted "seafront"). In addition to this, the nearby Paris Square is reached by the Carmelite, which drains passenger traffic from the Carmel Ridge. As of today, it will be difficult from a practical point of view to convince someone that a station in "Givorum" is better than Kiryat Shvarem.

    • Hello Dvir, I understood that there are 4 rails. The alternative is that all 4 tracks will be routed like the Carmel tunnels through Haifa.
      The two suburbs will stop at all the stations: Atlit, Hoof HaCarmel, Wadi Givorim, Check Post, Chutz Hamfaretz, Kiryat Haim, Kiryat Motzkin and beyond.
      The high-speed trains will only stop at 3 stations in Haifa, as is the case in Tokyo with the Shinkansen: Tsek Post, Wadi HaGivori, Hoof HaCarmel. And from there it will accelerate to 250 km/h until Tel Aviv.
      Haifa North station (main Check Post central station): serving Nesher / Check Post, suburban Kiryat Haim, passengers from the Emek line / Karmiel line.
      Haifa Carmel station (father of Nahal Givorim): from Kiryat HaGivorim, Wadi Salib, Haifa Port, Moshava, Bat Galim, Kiryat Eliezer - Matronic road Nahal Hagivorim axis. All the neighborhoods of the Carmel Ridge, Neve Shanan and Ramot Yitzchak - arrival by bus lines to the Nahal Giborim central / Grand Canyon which will be built above the station.
      South Haifa Station (Haber HaKarmel Beach): Tirat Carmel, West Haifa neighborhoods, Matam, and also Bat Galim and Kiryat Eliezer - Matron through Hagana to HaKarmel Beach.
      In fact, in this configuration, all Haifa neighborhoods will be up to 10 minutes away by metro/bus to a train station with fast trains to the north and south. Those who want to go to Atlit, or to Kiryat Haim, will simply wait for the ferry that will pass through the same stations in the other two tunnels.

    • Dvir Let's take four scripts and see the alternative I propose. (a) I am a resident of Kiryat Motzkin Neve Ganim who works at the Rambam. (b) I am a resident of Tirat HaCarmel who works outside the bay.
      A. Until today, I needed a suburban train or a slow subway train, half an hour to Rambam. In Kiryat Motzkin, the Kiryat Central will be built. I take every train on it - I don't have to wait almost at all, they all stop at the Haifa Carmel station and Edi HaGivori. From there, I get on the metro station one platform towards Haifa. There is a matron on the board that goes through the Wadi Saliv, Kiryat Hamel and Mosheva stations and an express matron to the lower city and Bat Galim - I take that and within ten minutes I get off at the Rambam station.
      B. I leave the Carmel Castle by bus to the Haifa South station. There I take a commuter train to the Gulf Crossing station.
      third. In Acre, I get on the fast train to Hab Haifa South, because I know I have a few minutes left to change to a slower suburban train that will go from there to Atlit. At Hav Hav HaCarmel I move to the suburban platform and take a suburban train to Atlit.
      d. I take a bus from the Technion five minutes to Nahal Givorim central station and take the elevator to Haifa Carmel station. There he takes a fast train in half an hour to Shafiim. And there, a platform changes to the suburbs, 10 minutes to Herzliya station.

    • Hello Dvir, I could not understand how a combination of alternatives 9 and 11 would work. Does it mean that only in alternative 9 will the high-speed rails pass through, and in alternative 11 the suburban rails? Because if so, it is indeed very problematic - they don't actually allow a high-speed line from Haifa to Tel Aviv (other than through the central station of the Gulf, which is at the edge of the city). With all due respect to the north, the main goal in the end is to connect Haifa to Tel Aviv, this is the main burden. It is impossible to have a high-speed line from Hariya to Tel Aviv, but from Haifa we will have to make do with a suburban line...

  25. I think this is great news for Haifa. I would suggest another alternative, in my opinion one that would better serve the 100 residents of Ramot Carmel, 60 residents of Neve Shanan: I think the tunnel should be on a route similar to that of the Carmel tunnels and I will explain why. The route of the Carmel Tunnels consists of two inclined sections that exit through openings in the Valley of the Heroes near the Grand Canyon. For heavy rail, a level route is required. In the tunnels on this axis, the train will "exit" at the bottom of Wadi Hagivor. There, at the bottom of Huadi, a train station with parking lots, a bus station on levels, near the Grand Canyon should be built. The train station will be connected by a pedestrian bridge over Huadi to Jezreeliya and Neve Shanan and will allow walking to the Rumma Hall. Large elevators, similar to the Yitzhak Navon - Hauma station, will take passengers up to Simcha Golan street level.
    The advantage of this alternative - that this train station will serve over 160 thousand residents of Haifa without having to get off by car and get on by car to one of the existing stations. It is also connected to the Carmel tunnels (metron line 4) and the levels above it will also be used as an emergency parking lot, a large car park, and a bus parking lot that will allow for improved service to all the Carmel neighborhoods.
    From the Grand Canyon station, the train will continue to the Check Post station. From the Grand Canyon station, there will also be a matron on the route through Nahal Givorim to Kiryat Havlam, Bat Galim, and back to the Carmel beach. As Lengar pointed out, the advantage of moving the Hoof Carmel station would allow for the development of a huge flat area between the Dado Promenade and the Hoof Carmel Central without the existing buffer of the tracks, the bridge over the tracks, the station. All of this will disappear and we will get an amazing flat quality area for development.
    The Mount Carmel station will be rebuilt and the entire tunneling process, and the construction of the new Mount Carmel station will not require the closing of the railroad tracks, as is the alternative of doubling them in the existing location and rebuilding the Mount Carmel station in its current location, which will actually result in 4 years of closing the train from Mount Carmel to the north, a huge economic disaster for Haifa and to the entire north.
    On the other hand, the tunnel can be built at the same time as the regular regular operation of the train, when the money for the electrification through the coast will also be saved and invested in the electrification through the mountain, and in the construction of the new Carmel Beach stations and the new Wadi HaGivoriv. The connection between the Wadi HaGivuri station and Check Post will be the second tunnel, just like the Carmel tunnels now, and there the train will connect to the tracks to the north and the valleys.
    The removal of Bat Galim station and Haifa Center, as well as the tracks that cross them - will make it possible to market vast areas for quality development near the sea and on the sea front, something that will help finance the tunneling and the construction of the new stations.
    This is the best, correct, applicable, cheapest and least offensive plan and it is good that these alternatives were verified and examined instead of the imaginary sinking somewhere in the future and in the meantime decades of railway electrification fences and 4 rails stuck like a belt around the coastline.

  26. Accept a correction of a small mistake, which started in "The Marker": the chairman of the Greens in Haifa is my friend Avihu Hahn. Although I represented his position in the appeal, I am the former chairman.

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